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HellfireUnitLevel Six
Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 9th 2020, 8:56 pm
- In character
- Neutral ground
R1: POD Bane versus TFU Marek
Sabers
Force
All out
R2: DOE Bane replaces Palpatine at the end of TFU
All out
R3: DOE Bane versus TFU 2 Marek
Sabers
Force
All out
- Neutral ground
R1: POD Bane versus TFU Marek
Sabers
Force
All out
R2: DOE Bane replaces Palpatine at the end of TFU
All out
R3: DOE Bane versus TFU 2 Marek
Sabers
Force
All out
MPModerator | Champion of Darkness
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 10th 2020, 3:24 am
PoD might lose, but more likely win.
DoE Bane wins.
DoE Bane wins.
HeartoftheForceLevel Two
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 10th 2020, 5:28 am
Meatpants wrote:PoD might lose, but more likely win.
DoE Bane wins.
- MPModerator | Champion of Darkness
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 10th 2020, 7:18 am
On second thought, both Banes stomp.
Latham2000Level Three
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 10th 2020, 7:57 am
Let’s not stand on ceremony here.
Bane wins.
Bane wins.
- MPModerator | Champion of Darkness
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 10th 2020, 11:00 am
How is SK holding a light here?
NevesYtneves (DC77)Level Seven
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 10th 2020, 6:39 pm
A better question is, why does Bane win, let alone stomp?
BreakofDawnLevel Seven
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 10th 2020, 9:33 pm
Sjuttiosju wrote:A better question is, why does Bane win, let alone stomp?
- MPModerator | Champion of Darkness
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 11th 2020, 2:01 am
VOTJ scaling just comes off way better in comparison. Starkiller is at best a spot about TFU2 Vader, who experiences phenomenal growth up to ROTJ. On the other hand, PoD Bane is like seven ragdoll tier gaps above the Kyle Katarn who could beat all of Jerec's Dark Jedi and can hold his own against a rival of Vader in some continuities of the story.
DoE Bane? Disgusting growth from his PoD incarnation there as well. There's just way too many ragdoll tier gaps to justify Starkiller winning.
DoE Bane? Disgusting growth from his PoD incarnation there as well. There's just way too many ragdoll tier gaps to justify Starkiller winning.
- NevesYtneves (DC77)Level Seven
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 11th 2020, 7:39 am
@Meatpants:
Starkiller was exhausted beyond relief during his duel with Vader as per the novelization. A better method of comparison is Galen's ability to hold against Sheev's lightning, despite Sidious being orders of magnitude more powerful than Bane by all indication.
The Dark Jedi point is irrelevant, they're all no names who have no connectivity to Vader. Moreover, far as I recall (correct me if I'm wrong on this because I may well be) the novelization takes presedence and in it Kyle never duels Jerec or displays anything resembling parity.
Starkiller is at best a spot about TFU2 Vader, who experiences phenomenal growth up to ROTJ.
Starkiller was exhausted beyond relief during his duel with Vader as per the novelization. A better method of comparison is Galen's ability to hold against Sheev's lightning, despite Sidious being orders of magnitude more powerful than Bane by all indication.
On the other hand, PoD Bane is like seven ragdoll tier gaps above the Kyle Katarn who could beat all of Jerec's Dark Jedi and can hold his own against a rival of Vader in some continuities of the story.
The Dark Jedi point is irrelevant, they're all no names who have no connectivity to Vader. Moreover, far as I recall (correct me if I'm wrong on this because I may well be) the novelization takes presedence and in it Kyle never duels Jerec or displays anything resembling parity.
- Latham2000Level Three
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 11th 2020, 8:00 am
On second thoughts, not really sure who winsLatham2000 wrote:Let’s not stand on ceremony here.
Bane wins.
CuckedCurryLevel Four
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 11th 2020, 9:58 am
Meatpants wrote:VOTJ scaling just comes off way better in comparison. Starkiller is at best a spot about TFU2 Vader, who experiences phenomenal growth up to ROTJ. On the other hand, PoD Bane is like seven ragdoll tier gaps above the Kyle Katarn who could beat all of Jerec's Dark Jedi and can hold his own against a rival of Vader in some continuities of the story.
DoE Bane? Disgusting growth from his PoD incarnation there as well. There's just way too many ragdoll tier gaps to justify Starkiller winning.
- MPModerator | Champion of Darkness
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 11th 2020, 10:01 am
Exhaustion argument doesn’t hold. Many Force users have fought above their combative ability while extremely low on Force reserves, like Qui-Gon. The lightning feat doesn’t scale him for a variety of reasons, and is likely a DESTINY feat.
Nothing says the novelisation > the game. In fact, if anything, the game would be the true canon path because the databank specifically references the duel between Kyle and Jerec.
Nothing says the novelisation > the game. In fact, if anything, the game would be the true canon path because the databank specifically references the duel between Kyle and Jerec.
Master AzrongerModerator
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 11th 2020, 10:15 am
Jerec still tries to kill Kyle in the novelization with amped Force destruction. It fails, whereas Kyle mused he would die in the process of making the thought bomb and that he was a novice compared to Brotherhood of Darkness fodder.
_________________
- NevesYtneves (DC77)Level Seven
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 23rd 2020, 1:40 pm
@Meatpants:
And many have not (Luke for example). It all depends on the degree. That said, considering SK is weaker than when he struggled to perform feats well below his paygrade I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that he was severely out of it. Qui-Gon however, has nothing to suggest his exhaustion was noteworthy, thus making it a false equivalency that does not negatively affect SK in the slightest.
Expand on the destiny point, because outside of that there's no real basis for it not scaling him. Depending on the iteration he takes it for 20-30 seconds, in spite of Sids being fuelled by his desperation, which is indicative of him being well beyond someone like Bane.
Quote from the Databank? If it exists I'll concede on this point, not that it matters considering SK's exhaustion.
Exhaustion argument doesn’t hold. Many Force users have fought above their combative ability while extremely low on Force reserves, like Qui-Gon.
And many have not (Luke for example). It all depends on the degree. That said, considering SK is weaker than when he struggled to perform feats well below his paygrade I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that he was severely out of it. Qui-Gon however, has nothing to suggest his exhaustion was noteworthy, thus making it a false equivalency that does not negatively affect SK in the slightest.
The lightning feat doesn’t scale him for a variety of reasons, and is likely a DESTINY feat.
Expand on the destiny point, because outside of that there's no real basis for it not scaling him. Depending on the iteration he takes it for 20-30 seconds, in spite of Sids being fuelled by his desperation, which is indicative of him being well beyond someone like Bane.
Nothing says the novelisation > the game. In fact, if anything, the game would be the true canon path because the databank specifically references the duel between Kyle and Jerec.
Quote from the Databank? If it exists I'll concede on this point, not that it matters considering SK's exhaustion.
- MPModerator | Champion of Darkness
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 25th 2020, 1:49 am
And many have not (Luke for example). It all depends on the degree. That said, considering SK is weaker than when he struggled to perform feats well below his paygrade I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that he was severely out of it. Qui-Gon however, has nothing to suggest his exhaustion was noteworthy, thus making it a false equivalency that does not negatively affect SK in the slightest.
What exactly is Starkiller's paygrade?
I'm not saying Starkiller wasn't affected at all per se, but rather that adrenaline rushes aren't unknown and are quite common among Force users. I don't know where Starkiller lies in that spectrum, but what I do know is that there's no convincing evidence that he's actually a blitz/ragdoll tier gap above Vader, and the only reason he can't win is because he's exhausted, even though we know from numerous examples that Force users who are sufficiently desperate can summon up adrenaline rushes. Starkiller never expresses difficulty accessing his power. Compare to say, Qui-Gon, Dooku or Caedus - all very legitimate POV examples of them noting their power is failing, but summon up the willpower to continue fighting.
I've yet to collect them all, but ESB/ROTJ Luke is also stated multiple times to be Vader's toughest challenge as well.
Expand on the destiny point, because outside of that there's no real basis for it not scaling him. Depending on the iteration he takes it for 20-30 seconds, in spite of Sids being fuelled by his desperation, which is indicative of him being well beyond someone like Bane.
Galen is given as a specific example. However, I do not dispute that he's a prodigy with immense Force potential. If we're talking about the Sidious thing, there's multiple ways to attack it. The two most prominent ones are (1) Starkiller's most potent feat is tanked by the Emperor - all his midichlorians exploding right on top of him, and he comes out without issue or even phased in the slightest (2) Enlightened Galen is ragdolled by the Emperor in the dark side version of the game. Yes, it is Enlightened Galen, because he "regrets" killing Vader, so there's no reason to assume he doesn't revert back to his default state. Even then, we know that there's no evidence of much difference between DS Galen and LS Galen, because it still takes him a while to outduel Vader despite his new clarity, and only telekinetically dominates his opponent after an extended duel where Vader suffers three deep lightsaber cuts. Either way you look at it, the Emperor can ragdoll Galen. It's also implied quite heavily that Starkiller is walking through the lightning due to having the will to see his destiny fulfilled.
Quote from the Databank? If it exists I'll concede on this point, not that it matters considering SK's exhaustion. Darth Bane versus Galen Marek 228124001
Deep in the Valley of the Jedi, Kyle confronted Jerec, the very man who had killed Morgan Katarn. The two did battle, and when Kyle slew Jerec, he fulfilled an ancient prophecy. The spirits of long-dead Jedi, trapped in the Valley for a thousand years, were finally freed. With this energy unleashed, the Valley of the Jedi's worth as a weapon was effectively eliminated.
- Caelus Pall
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 25th 2020, 1:16 pm
Galen decisively in all rounds, with R1 being a spite round.
- Master AzrongerModerator
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 25th 2020, 1:17 pm
@Caelus Pall Welcome to the forum. From where do you hail?
_________________
- Caelus Pall
Re: Darth Bane versus Galen Marek
July 25th 2020, 1:21 pm
Master Azronger wrote:@Caelus Pall Welcome to the forum. From where do you hail?
SpaceBattles.
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